[Taxacom] Type species from unavailable genus name
Francisco Welter-Schultes
fwelter at gwdg.de
Sat May 12 17:39:21 CDT 2018
Absolutely, Stephen. I did not intend to oppose to that point.
-----
Francisco
Am 13.05.2018 um 00:35 schrieb Stephen Thorpe:
> Francisco,
> Yes, but there are other scenarios, e.g. genus A is validated with a type species which is not congeneric with that of genus B. At any rate, my point was that even if A remains unavailable, it would be a better idea to validate it in preference to proposing B. Otherwise a perfectly good name (A) falls out of the system.
> Stephen
> --------------------------------------------
> On Sun, 13/5/18, Francisco Welter-Schultes <fwelter at gwdg.de> wrote:
>
> Subject: Re: [Taxacom] Type species from unavailable genus name
> To: taxacom at mailman.nhm.ku.edu
> Received: Sunday, 13 May, 2018, 10:27 AM
>
> There are many records in the
> literature for genus A. If genus A was
> unavailable from the 1968 paper, the next
> occasion after 1968 and before
> 2000 must be
> found where genus A was mentioned with a short description
>
> and with one single species included. This
> would have made genus A
> available at that
> occasion (type fixation by monotypy), with a different
> author and a slightly later date. And hopefully
> without a spelling error...
>
> Only if all such candidate publications were
> checked and none was among
> them that
> unintentionally made the genus A name available, then a
> genus
> B can be established.
>
> Cheers
> Francisco
>
> Am
> 13.05.2018 um 00:16 schrieb Stephen Thorpe:
> > OK, if that was the question, then I agree
> with Laurent's answer. I read it as Mikhail intended to
> propose genus B himself. However, my comment still stands
> that whoever proposed genus B would have been wiser to
> validate genus A instead!
> > Stephen
> >
> >
> --------------------------------------------
> > On Sat, 12/5/18, Laurent Raty <l.raty at skynet.be>
> wrote:
> >
> >
> Subject: Re: [Taxacom] Type species from unavailable genus
> name
> > To: taxacom at mailman.nhm.ku.edu
> > Received: Saturday, 12 May, 2018, 9:36
> PM
> >
> > Is
> Mikhail's question really
> >
> understood as he meant it...?
> >
> Perhaps
> > I'm the one who is
> misreading it, but I don't think
> >
> the question
> > was about valid names,
> or the
> > intended introduction of any
> new generic
> > name. I would understand
> the question as:
> >
> > What is the correct way to
> > cite the type species of a genus
> (here,
> > "genus B", type
> species fixed by
> > monotypy -- i.e.,
> presumably simply
> > originally
> included in B as "B
> >
> somespecies"), when said type species was
> > established in combination with a
> generic name
> > ("genus A")
> that was
> > unavailable...?
> >
> > (I would go
> with "A somespecies
> >
> Originalauthor, Year", in agreement with
> > Rec. 67B. Even though "A" has
> (or
> > had) no nomenclatural
> standing.)
> >
> >
> Cheers, L -
> >
> >
>
> > On 05/12/2018 12:31 AM, Neal
> > Evenhuis wrote:
> >
> > I searched Google
> > Scholar and
> there are over 50,000 hits for "Genus
> > A", so it has indeed been used
> quite a bit….
> > >
> > > ;-)
> >
> >
> > >
> >
> > Neal L. Evenhuis, PhD.
> > >
> Senior Entomologist
> > >
> >
> > > Bernice
> Pauahi Bishop Museum
> > > 1525
> Bernice Street, Honolulu, HI
> >
> 96817-2704
> > > Office: (808)
> 848-4138
> > > Fax: (808) 847-8252
> > >
> >
> BishopMuseum.org<www.bishopmuseum.org>
> > >
> > >
> > > On Stardate 5/11/18, 12:24 PM,
> > Star-trooper "Taxacom on behalf of
> Stephen Thorpe"
> > <taxacom-bounces at mailman.nhm.ku.edu<mailto:taxacom-bounces at mailman.nhm.ku.edu>
> > on behalf of stephen_thorpe at yahoo.co.nz<mailto:stephen_thorpe at yahoo.co.nz>>
> > wrote:
> > >
> > > The
> >
> unavailability of genus A is not fixed forever! The name
> > should be validated (which effectively
> means used as new
> > again) before any
> alternative new generic names are
> >
> introduced for any of the included species!
> > > Cheers,
> >
> > Stephen
> > >
> > >
> >
> --------------------------------------------
> > > On Sat, 12/5/18, Mikhail Daneliya
> <mdaneliya at gmail.com<mailto:mdaneliya at gmail.com>>
> > wrote:
> > >
> > > Subject:
> >
> [Taxacom] Type species from unavailable genus name
> > > To: Taxacom at mailman.nhm.ku.edu<mailto:Taxacom at mailman.nhm.ku.edu>
> > > Received: Saturday, 12 May, 2018,
> 1:40
> > AM
> > >
> Genus A was described for two
> >
> species after
> > > 1931, but type
> species
> > was not
> > > designated. The genus name A is
> > thus
> > >
> unavailable. Despite that more
> >
> species
> > > under genus name A have
> been
> > described
> > > subsequently. One of them
> > seems to
> > >
> be a new genus B, with a type
> >
> species
> > > by monotypy. What is
> the
> > correct name
> > > for the type species? A.
> > somespecies
> >
> > Originalauthor, Year; B.
> >
> somespecies
> > > (Originalauthor,
> Year); or
> > else?
> > > Appreciate your help!
> > > Mikhail Daneliya
> > >
> >
> _______________________________________________
> > > Taxacom Mailing List
> > >
> > Send
> Taxacom mailing list submissions
> >
> >
> > to: Taxacom at mailman.nhm.ku.edu<mailto:Taxacom at mailman.nhm.ku.edu>
> > > http://mailman.nhm.ku.edu/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/taxacom
> > > The Taxacom Archive back to 1992
> may be
> > > searched at: http://taxacom.markmail.org
> > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via
> the
> > > Web, visit: http://mailman.nhm.ku.edu/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/taxacom
> > > You can reach the person managing
> the
> > > list at: taxacom-owner at mailman.nhm.ku.edu<mailto:taxacom-owner at mailman.nhm.ku.edu>
> > > Nurturing Nuance while
> Assaulting
> > > Ambiguity for 31
> Some Years, 1987-2018.
> > >
> >
> _______________________________________________
> > > Taxacom Mailing List
> > >
> > Send
> Taxacom mailing list submissions to: Taxacom at mailman.nhm.ku.edu<mailto:Taxacom at mailman.nhm.ku.edu>
> > >
> > > http://mailman.nhm.ku.edu/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/taxacom
> > > The Taxacom Archive back to 1992
> may be
> > searched at: http://taxacom.markmail.org
> > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via
> the Web,
> > visit: http://mailman.nhm.ku.edu/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/taxacom
> > > You can reach the person managing
> the list
> > at: taxacom-owner at mailman.nhm.ku.edu<mailto:taxacom-owner at mailman.nhm.ku.edu>
> > >
> > >
> Nurturing Nuance
> > while Assaulting
> Ambiguity for 31 Some Years, 1987-2018.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> ________________________________
> >
> > This message is only intended for the
> > addressee named above. Its contents may
> be privileged or
> > otherwise
> protected. Any unauthorized use, disclosure or
> > copying of this message or its contents
> is prohibited. If
> > you have received
> this message by mistake, please notify us
> > immediately by reply mail or by collect
> telephone call. Any
> > personal
> opinions expressed in this message do not
> > necessarily represent the views of the
> Bishop Museum.
> > >
> >
> _______________________________________________
> > > Taxacom Mailing List
> > >
> > Send
> Taxacom mailing list submissions to: Taxacom at mailman.nhm.ku.edu
> > >
> > > http://mailman.nhm.ku.edu/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/taxacom
> > > The Taxacom Archive back to 1992
> may be
> > searched at: http://taxacom.markmail.org
> > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via
> the Web,
> > visit: http://mailman.nhm.ku.edu/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/taxacom
> > > You can reach the person managing
> the list
> > at: taxacom-owner at mailman.nhm.ku.edu
> > >
> > >
> Nurturing Nuance
> > while Assaulting
> Ambiguity for 31 Some Years, 1987-2018.
> > >
> >
> >
> _______________________________________________
> > Taxacom Mailing List
> > Send
> > Taxacom
> mailing list submissions to: Taxacom at mailman.nhm.ku.edu
> >
> > http://mailman.nhm.ku.edu/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/taxacom
> > The Taxacom Archive back to 1992 may
> be
> > searched at: http://taxacom.markmail.org
> > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the
> Web, visit:
> > http://mailman.nhm.ku.edu/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/taxacom
> > You can reach the person managing the
> list at:
> > taxacom-owner at mailman.nhm.ku.edu
> >
> > Nurturing
> Nuance while
> > Assaulting Ambiguity
> for 31 Some Years, 1987-2018.
> >
> >
> _______________________________________________
> > Taxacom Mailing List
> >
> Send Taxacom mailing list submissions to: Taxacom at mailman.nhm.ku.edu
> >
> > http://mailman.nhm.ku.edu/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/taxacom
> > The Taxacom Archive back to 1992 may be
> searched at: http://taxacom.markmail.org
> > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the Web,
> visit: http://mailman.nhm.ku.edu/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/taxacom
> > You can reach the person managing the list
> at: taxacom-owner at mailman.nhm.ku.edu
> >
> > Nurturing Nuance
> while Assaulting Ambiguity for 31 Some Years, 1987-2018.
> >
> _______________________________________________
> Taxacom Mailing List
> Send
> Taxacom mailing list submissions to: Taxacom at mailman.nhm.ku.edu
>
> http://mailman.nhm.ku.edu/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/taxacom
> The Taxacom Archive back to 1992 may be
> searched at: http://taxacom.markmail.org
> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the Web, visit:
> http://mailman.nhm.ku.edu/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/taxacom
> You can reach the person managing the list at:
> taxacom-owner at mailman.nhm.ku.edu
>
> Nurturing Nuance while
> Assaulting Ambiguity for 31 Some Years, 1987-2018.
>
> .
>
More information about the Taxacom
mailing list