Taxacom: botanical names with racist history

Mon Jul 22 06:48:41 CDT 2024

I fully agree that this is nonsense. In another 50 or 100 years from now, some recent names might become unacceptable to the next generation of biologists.

Ron
________________________________
From: Taxacom <taxacom-bounces at lists.ku.edu> on behalf of Stephen Thorpe via Taxacom <taxacom at lists.ku.edu>
Sent: Monday, 22 July 2024 13:39
To: Thomas Pape <tpape at snm.ku.dk>
Cc: taxacom at lists.ku.edu <taxacom at lists.ku.edu>
Subject: Re: Taxacom: botanical names with racist history

So it is virtue signalling then. Of course, although it results in the objectionable names no longer being used as valid names, they still need to be used as synonyms and anyone who wants to look up any published info on the species from before the replacement still has to know to look it up under the old name. So, why aren’t they still offended by the name as a synonym? It is all just woke nonsense!

Stephen

Sent from my iPhone

> On 22/07/2024, at 11:19 PM, Thomas Pape via Taxacom <taxacom at lists.ku.edu> wrote:
>
> The proposal includes the retention of author attribution and date and place of publication.
> The proposal is given below.
>
> /Thomas
>
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Art. 60 Prop. G: ”Add a new Article 61.6 and two Examples: “61.6. Epithets with the root caf[f][e]r-, such as cafra, caffra, cafrorum, and cafrum, are not permitted in the nomenclature of organisms covered by the Botanical Code. Where these epithets were used in validly published names, they are to be treated as orthographical variants that are to be replaced by epithets with the root af[e]r-, such as afra, afrorum, and afrum, respectively. If this results in a later homonym, the correct name is determined by Art. 11.4.”
>
> “Ex. 4. When the epithet ‘cafra’ in Plantago ‘cafra’ Decne. (in Candolle, Prodr. 13(1): 719. 1852) is replaced by afra, P. afra Decne. (l.c.), i.e. with retention of author attribution and date and place of publication, is a later homonym of P. afra L. (Sp. Pl., ed. 2: 168. 1762) and therefore illegitimate. Under Art. 11.4 the name that has to be adopted is P. capillaris E. Mey. ex Decne. (in Candolle, Prodr. 13(1): 719. 1852), which is widely treated as a heterotypic synonym of P. cafra.”
>
> “Ex. 5. Portulaca ‘caffra’ Thunb. (Prodr. Pl. Cap.: [85]. 1800) is to be treated as having been published as P. afra Thunb. (l.c.), i.e. with retention of author attribution and date and place of publication. When treated as a species of Talinum Adans., the name is T. afrum [with one f] (Thunb.) Eckl. & Zeyh. (Enum. Pl. Afric. Austral.: 282. 1836).”
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Taxacom <taxacom-bounces at lists.ku.edu> On Behalf Of Stephen Thorpe via Taxacom
> Sent: 22. juli 2024 13:03
> To: Mike Sadka <mike.sadka at nhm.ac.uk>; José H. Leal <jleal at shellmuseum.org>
> Cc: taxacom at lists.ku.edu
> Subject: Re: Taxacom: botanical names with racist history
>
> Mike,I suspect that what we have here is possibly a mixture of two things: the so-called "mihi itch", whereby some taxonomists would love to be able to invalidate older names so that they can get their names as taxon authorities on the replacement names. However, it is not clear from the caffer example if the original authorship would remain? So maybe it is just a simple case of virtue signalling, wherein some taxonomists are less concerned with taxonomy and more concerned with appearing to be politically "virtuous" or perhaps just "trendy", jumping on the woke bandwagon, for whatever reason anyone likes to do these things?? They say that all civilizations ultimately implode and destroy themselves. Perhaps taxonomy has reached the stage now where it is starting to unravel and undermine itself, infected by political agendas (and publicity seeking agendas which result in species being named after irrelevant celebrities and paper titles reading more like tabloid headlines). Maybe this is the start of "the great undoing"? Whatever it is, it isn't good. The bad guys are trying to make themselves out to be the "virtuous" ones, for the sake of their own gratification!Stephen
>    On Monday, 22 July 2024 at 10:48:51 pm NZST, José H. Leal <jleal at shellmuseum.org> wrote:
>
> As a "woke" person but one seriously in favor of nomenclatural stability I recommend this text https://nam10.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.researchgate.net%2Fpublication%2F381547435_Protecting_stable_biological_nomenclatural_systems_enables_universal_communication_A_collective_international_appeal________________________________________________&data=05%7C02%7Ctaxacom%40lists.ku.edu%7Ca54df37d0a7243c333f508dcaa443eb1%7C3c176536afe643f5b96636feabbe3c1a%7C0%7C0%7C638572457455954181%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C40000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=%2BdJq%2B9iUWF21mGXatuTcsNKBvwI9mPFa61Oy6bqLNe4%3D&reserved=0<https://nam10.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.researchgate.net%2Fpublication%2F381547435_Protecting_stable_biological_nomenclatural_systems_enables_universal_communication_A_collective_international_appeal________________________________________________&data=05%7C02%7Ctaxacom%40lists.ku.edu%7Ca54df37d0a7243c333f508dcaa443eb1%7C3c176536afe643f5b96636feabbe3c1a%7C0%7C0%7C638572457455954181%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C40000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=%2BdJq%2B9iUWF21mGXatuTcsNKBvwI9mPFa61Oy6bqLNe4%3D&reserved=0>
> José H. Leal, Ph.D. | Science Director & Curator (he/him)
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> On Mon, Jul 22, 2024 at 6:40 AM Mike Sadka via Taxacom <taxacom at lists.ku.edu> wrote:
>
> Hi all
>
> Interested as I am in this debate, as an IT person I do not feel qualified to comment.
>
> However, I do wonder if this debate is being driven by genuine offence at the names in question being taken by people from populations who suffered colonial exploitation, or is coming from others who are concerned on behalf of those people, who perhaps are not as offended by historical names as some suggest.
>
> This paper makes some very interesting points AGAINST these kinds of name changes from the perspective of one who might be expected to be offended by the historical names:  https://nam10.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.biotaxa.org%2Fmegataxa%2Farticle%2Fview%2Fmegataxa.10.1.4%2F77025&data=05%7C02%7Ctaxacom%40lists.ku.edu%7Ca54df37d0a7243c333f508dcaa443eb1%7C3c176536afe643f5b96636feabbe3c1a%7C0%7C0%7C638572457455954181%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C40000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=pfPL55KK91UxP6nWaHjnc1ps%2FLH1lVk8P5dZZrAQTOU%3D&reserved=0<https://nam10.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.biotaxa.org%2Fmegataxa%2Farticle%2Fview%2Fmegataxa.10.1.4%2F77025&data=05%7C02%7Ctaxacom%40lists.ku.edu%7Ca54df37d0a7243c333f508dcaa443eb1%7C3c176536afe643f5b96636feabbe3c1a%7C0%7C0%7C638572457455954181%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C40000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=pfPL55KK91UxP6nWaHjnc1ps%2FLH1lVk8P5dZZrAQTOU%3D&reserved=0>
>
> Cheerio, Mike
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Taxacom <taxacom-bounces at lists.ku.edu> On Behalf Of Stephen Thorpe via Taxacom
> Sent: Monday, July 22, 2024 11:16 AM
> To: taxacom at lists.ku.edu; Mario Schädel <mario.schaedel at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: Taxacom: botanical names with racist history
>
>  Why don't people just get a thick skin and realise that a word which can be used as a racial (or other) slur is not being used as such in a taxonomic binomen? It is a commonplace notion that the same word can have different meanings in different contexts. For example, "Traditionally, faggots are made from offal, usually pork, and from the bits of the animal that are generally discarded but now tend to just be the liver and possibly, the heart". A bitch is a female dog, etc. It is a pseudo problem that is just a problem in the twisted minds of the wokies.
> Do you really need reminding that stability and universality are the fundamentals of taxonomic nomenclature?
> Stephen
>     On Monday, 22 July 2024 at 09:58:32 pm NZST, Mario Schädel via Taxacom <taxacom at lists.ku.edu> wrote:
>
>  What Stephen might call "pointless wokeism", I would rather call a respectful and justified gesture towards the people living and interacting with the affected plants, in a region, where this word unfortunately developed into a racial slur. What really matters for us as taxonomists is, that there is no reason to assume that these efforts to replace such names will vanish anytime soon. In my opinion, it is bad solution to just complain about these efforts and to try to prevent any such name changes by arguing on the grounds of rules that only a small crowd of people once agreed on.
>
> Instead, one could take action to structure such efforts in a way that such name changes would be easier to handle with respect to future nomenclatorial actions and the communication of names on websites and databases. A possible solution could be to establish repositories of officially recognized synonyms for the different codes. Suggested name changes could then be allowed or denied by a consortium. The replacement names could then be used as replacement names by those who prefer the new name over the old one. Of course, this would require changes in the respective nomenclatorial codes and a considerable and continuous effort. I think it is better to make this effort than to get to a point, where replacement names will be proposed and used without compliance to the codes.
>
> Personally, I am happy that the botanical community voted in favor of replacing the name. However, I think for the future one should really think about who gets to vote on such issues. This is, because, depending on the mood of the taxonomic community, this vote could have easily turned out differently, despite a name change may (or not) be in the interest of people who interact with the plants.
>
> Best wishes,
>
> Mario
>
>
>> On 7/22/24 7:36 AM, Stephen Thorpe via Taxacom wrote:
>>   The action taken is a pointless wokeism and highly disruptive to taxonomy. Where will it end? What about all the niger, nigra, nigri- names? What are you going to replace them with? I don't see artists removing now "offensive" terms retrospectively from music or literature. What's the difference? The whole point was that the terms weren't used as offensive when they were used. They are part of history which does not need rewriting.
>> Stephen
>>       On Monday, 22 July 2024 at 04:41:13 pm NZST, Jeremy Bruhl via Taxacom<taxacom at lists.ku.edu>  wrote:
>>
>>   Dear John
>>
>> Words master and can hurt deeply. The action taken is measured and reasonable.
>>
>> Cheers,  Jeremy
>>
>> Sent from Outlook for
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>> ________________________________
>> From: Taxacom<taxacom-bounces at lists.ku.edu>  on behalf of John Grehan
>> via Taxacom<taxacom at lists.ku.edu>
>> Sent: Monday, July 22, 2024 5:58:23 am
>> To: taxacom<taxacom at mailman.nhm.ku.edu>
>> Subject: Taxacom: botanical names with racist history
>>
>> Statements below from a web site. Can any botanist on Taxacom comment
>> further on this?
>>
>> Scientists have voted to eliminate the names of certain plants that
>> are deemed to be racially offensive. The decision to remove a label
>> that contains such a slur was taken last week after a gruelling
>> six-day session attended by more than 100 researchers, as part of the
>> International Botanical Congress, which officially opens on Sunday in Madrid.
>>
>> The effect of the vote will be that all plants, fungi and algae names
>> that contain the word *caffra*, which originates in insults made
>> against Black people, will be replaced by the word *affra* to denote
>> their African origins. More than 200 species will be affected,
>> including the coast coral tree, which will be known as *Erythrina
>> affra* instead of *Erythrina caffra* .
>>
>> The scientists attending the nomenclature session also agreed to
>> create a special committee which would rule on names given to newly
>> discovered plants, fungi and algae. These are usually named by those
>> who first describe them in the scientific literature. However, the
>> names could now be overruled by the committee if they are deemed to be
>> derogatory to a group or race
>>
>> --
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> Nurturing nuance while assailing ambiguity for about 37 years, 1987-2024.
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> Send Taxacom mailing list submissions to: taxacom at lists.ku.edu For list information; to subscribe or unsubscribe, visit: https://nam10.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Flists.ku.edu%2Flistinfo%2Ftaxacom&data=05%7C02%7Ctaxacom%40lists.ku.edu%7Ca54df37d0a7243c333f508dcaa443eb1%7C3c176536afe643f5b96636feabbe3c1a%7C0%7C0%7C638572457456110431%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C40000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=NoK3MWkKUpSccE5nGT1rUklJzcueMIWg979oo5vKhGs%3D&reserved=0<https://lists.ku.edu/listinfo/taxacom>
> You can reach the person managing the list at: taxacom-owner at lists.ku.edu
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> Nurturing nuance while assailing ambiguity for about 37 years, 1987-2024.
>
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> Send Taxacom mailing list submissions to: taxacom at lists.ku.edu
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> You can reach the person managing the list at: taxacom-owner at lists.ku.edu
>
> Nurturing nuance while assailing ambiguity for about 37 years, 1987-2024.
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Taxacom Mailing List
>
> Send Taxacom mailing list submissions to: taxacom at lists.ku.edu
> For list information; to subscribe or unsubscribe, visit: https://nam10.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Flists.ku.edu%2Flistinfo%2Ftaxacom&data=05%7C02%7Ctaxacom%40lists.ku.edu%7Ca54df37d0a7243c333f508dcaa443eb1%7C3c176536afe643f5b96636feabbe3c1a%7C0%7C0%7C638572457456110431%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C40000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=NoK3MWkKUpSccE5nGT1rUklJzcueMIWg979oo5vKhGs%3D&reserved=0<https://lists.ku.edu/listinfo/taxacom>
> You can reach the person managing the list at: taxacom-owner at lists.ku.edu
>
> Nurturing nuance while assailing ambiguity for about 37 years, 1987-2024.
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Taxacom Mailing List
>
> Send Taxacom mailing list submissions to: taxacom at lists.ku.edu
> For list information; to subscribe or unsubscribe, visit: https://nam10.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Flists.ku.edu%2Flistinfo%2Ftaxacom&data=05%7C02%7Ctaxacom%40lists.ku.edu%7Ca54df37d0a7243c333f508dcaa443eb1%7C3c176536afe643f5b96636feabbe3c1a%7C0%7C0%7C638572457456110431%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C40000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=NoK3MWkKUpSccE5nGT1rUklJzcueMIWg979oo5vKhGs%3D&reserved=0<https://lists.ku.edu/listinfo/taxacom>
> You can reach the person managing the list at: taxacom-owner at lists.ku.edu
>
> Nurturing nuance while assailing ambiguity for about 37 years, 1987-2024.
>
>

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You can reach the person managing the list at: taxacom-owner at lists.ku.edu

Nurturing nuance while assailing ambiguity for about 37 years, 1987-2024.