[Taxacom] Important note Re: two names online published - one new species

Sun Jan 24 14:40:03 CST 2016

As expected.
Still being pragmatic.
And Zootaxa again, out of context, but in your mind all the time.

Frank

-----Original Message-----
From: Stephen Thorpe [mailto:stephen_thorpe at yahoo.co.nz] 
Sent: Sunday, January 24, 2016 1:37 PM
To: deepreef at bishopmuseum.org; 'Stephen Thorpe' <stephen_thorpe at yahoo.co.nz>; taxacom at mailman.nhm.ku.edu; 'Doug Yanega' <dyanega at ucr.edu>; Frank T. Krell <Frank.Krell at dmns.org>
Cc: 'engel' <msengel at ku.edu>
Subject: RE: [Taxacom] Important note Re: two names online published - one new species

Frank,

That is a pretty darn liberal reinterpretation of:

8.5.3.1. The entry in the Official Register of Zoological Nomenclature must give the name and Internet address of an organization other than the publisher that is intended to permanently archive the work in a manner that preserves the content and layout, and is capable of doing so. This information is not required to appear in the work itself.

If we allow such dizzying levels of liberality, then it is pretty much "anything goes"! Besides, publishing with a publisher that still prints hard copies effectively IS archiving, but the Code is clearly not concerned with "effectively", and it just opens up a huge scope for everyone to disagree on the interpretation of the Code, thereby causing instability and nomenclatural chaos (none of which affects Zootaxa...)

Cheers,

Stephen

--------------------------------------------
On Mon, 25/1/16, Frank T. Krell <Frank.Krell at dmns.org> wrote:

 Subject: RE: [Taxacom] Important note Re: two names online published - one	new species
 To: "deepreef at bishopmuseum.org" <deepreef at bishopmuseum.org>, "'Stephen Thorpe'" <stephen_thorpe at yahoo.co.nz>, "taxacom at mailman.nhm.ku.edu" <taxacom at mailman.nhm.ku.edu>, "'Doug Yanega'" <dyanega at ucr.edu>
 Cc: "'engel'" <msengel at ku.edu>
 Received: Monday, 25 January, 2016, 9:31 AM

 I would see the criteria
 for availability more liberally. Publishing with a publisher  that archives all its publications anyway is an intention to  archive.
 Being pragmatic.

 Frank

 Dr Frank T. Krell
 Curator of Entomology
 Commissioner, International Commission on  Zoological Nomenclature  Chair, ICZN ZooBank  Committee  Department of Zoology  Denver Museum of Nature & Science
 2001 Colorado Boulevard
 Denver, CO 80205-5798 USA
 Frank.Krell at dmns.org

 Phone: (+1) (303) 370-8244
 Fax: (+1) (303) 331-6492
 http://www.dmns.org/science/museum-scientists/frank-krell
 lab page: http://www.dmns.org/krell-lab

 Test your powers of
 observation in The International Exhibition of Sherlock  Holmes, open until January 31. And prepare your palate for
 Chocolate: The Exhibition, opening February 12.

 The Denver Museum of Nature
 & Science salutes the citizens of metro Denver for  helping fund arts, culture and science through their support  of the Scientific and Cultural Facilities District (SCFD).

 -----Original Message-----
 From: Taxacom [mailto:taxacom-bounces at mailman.nhm.ku.edu]
 On Behalf Of Richard Pyle
 Sent: Sunday,
 January 24, 2016 12:42 PM
 To: 'Stephen
 Thorpe' <stephen_thorpe at yahoo.co.nz>;
 taxacom at mailman.nhm.ku.edu;
 'Doug Yanega' <dyanega at ucr.edu>
 Cc: 'engel' <msengel at ku.edu>
 Subject: Re: [Taxacom] Important note Re: two  names online published - one new species

 I can confirm that the Archive was added to  this record at 2016-01-23 12:21:46.330 UTC, by the same  login account that created the original registration.  Following the principle that the work becomes available when  all requirements are fulfilled (see my previous email reply  to Laurent on this list), and assuming all other  requirements for publication are met, my interpretation  would be that the date of publication for purposes of  priority should be 23 January 2016. If numerous copies of  the paper edition were simultaneously obtainable prior to  this date, and if the paper edition is in compliance with  the Code for published works printed on paper, then the date  of publication for purposes of priority should be  interpreted as the date on which numerous copies of the  printed edition were simultaneously obtainable (see Art.
 21.9).

 What is, or is not
 visible through the ZooBank website is irrelevant. The Code  makes reference to content in the Official Register of  Zoological Nomenclature, only a subset of which is visible  on the website itself.  Future versions of the ZooBank  website (pending development support) will include more  robust and publicly visible documentation of when specific  items were added or amended.

 Aloha,
 Rich

 > -----Original Message-----
 > From: Stephen Thorpe [mailto:stephen_thorpe at yahoo.co.nz]
 > Sent: Sunday, January 24, 2016 9:25 AM  > To: taxacom at mailman.nhm.ku.edu;  Doug Yanega  > Cc: deepreef at bishopmuseum.org;  engel  > Subject: Re: [Taxacom] Important  note Re: two names online published -  >  one new species  >  >  Doug,  >  > I'm not  sure that this was at all helpful! The addition of the  archive  > info isn't date stamped  (at least not for public view). Now the record  > misleadingly looks like valid online first  publication on 4 January 2016:
 > http://zoobank.org/References/07554C01-DEC3-4080-A337-B1F46BC9070F
 >
 > As far as I know,
 the print edition may not be published yet (all we  > know is that it is the January 2016 print  issue, which could be  > published in  February for all we know). So there may be no way to  > determine the true date of availability  for the new names. Even if we  > can get  a definitive date on the hard copy, this doesn't help  much, unless it is on or before 4 January 2016.
 >
 > Stephen
 >
 >
 --------------------------------------------
 > On Sun, 24/1/16, Doug Yanega <dyanega at ucr.edu>
 wrote:
 >
 >  Subject:
 [Taxacom] Important note Re: two names online published -

 > one new species
 >
 To: taxacom at mailman.nhm.ku.edu,
 "engel" <msengel at ku.edu>
 >  Received: Sunday, 24 January, 2016, 7:34  PM  >  >  I sent a  note to the authors of the  >  Kinzelbachilla paper (who had not  >  been CCed before as Mike Engel had), and they said they  have  fixed  > the ZooBank record so it  now includes the archive. Accordingly,  for  > the  public record, if we follow the  guideline as Rich suggested,  all  > of  the  criteria for availability have now been fulfilled for  the  name in their  work.
 >
 >  Most interesting of all, however, if  that they disagree  regarding  > these  two papers describing the same taxon, despite both being  from  > essentially the same type of  amber deposit:
 >
 >
 "By the way, it is not the same thing, the eyes, for  instance, are  > strikingly  different."
 >
 >  In other words, this may not be a matter  of competing for  priority,  > after  all, as Hans had originally supposed.
 >

 >  Peace,
 >
 >  --
 >  Doug Yanega
     Dept. of Entomology
 >
    Entomology Research Museum
 >  Univ. of California, Riverside, CA
 92521-0314
 >     skype:
 dyanega
 >  phone: (951) 827-4315
 (disclaimer: opinions are mine, not
 >
 UCR's)
 >                http://cache.ucr.edu/~heraty/yanega.html
 >     "There are some
 enterprises in which a  careful disorderliness  >           is the true  method" -  >  Herman Melville, Moby  Dick, Chap. 82  >  >  _______________________________________________
 >  Taxacom Mailing List
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 >  The Taxacom Archive back to 1992 may be  searched at:
 > http://taxacom.markmail.org
 >
 >  Celebrating 29
 years of Taxacom in 2016.

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