[Taxacom] [EXT] Re: NZ Royal Society fails to object to suppression and censorship of science

[John Grehan]

Hi Jason,

Sure they are free to do so. Point is that they do so. Their paper is
historically significant as an open admission that they would like to see
suppression or censorship of an opposing research program and the NZ Royal
Society has subsequently accepted that approach to science as
compatible with their ethics principles. Of course anyone is free to call
for suppression and censorship in science, but it's not something I find
acceptable, whether or not directed to a research field with which I have
sympathy. Even though I think most of the dispersalist biogeography is a
load of junk I would never engage in efforts to suppress or censor
opportunities for supporters to publish.

Cheers, John

On Wed, Aug 11, 2021 at 9:29 PM JF Mate via Taxacom <
taxacom at mailman.nhm.ku.edu> wrote:

> The authors (Water et al 2013) are free to call for rejection of
> panbiogeography papers but since its publication panbiogeography papers
> have continued to be published. I don't understand what you want the panel
> to do, punish the author's? Sure, calling for banning raises an eyebrow but
> you can't suppress them. You can argue against them.
>
> J
>
> On Tue., 10 Aug. 2021, 09:17 John Grehan via Taxacom, <
> taxacom at mailman.nhm.ku.edu> wrote:
>
> > Mary,
> >
> > this is not about rejection of a paper. This was about the Society
> > establishing a Panel to respond to a complaint that some of their members
> > acted in ways contrary to their ethics by calling for suppression and
> > censorship of a research program they opposed (that research program
> being
> > panbiogeography). That panel found nothing wrong with their members
> calling
> > for suppression or censorship and the Society leadership did not contest
> > that finding and has taken no further action. Thus, I am correct that the
> > Royal Society of New Zealand has failed to object to calls by some of its
> > members for censorship and suppression of panbiogeography. Thus the Royal
> > Society of NZ effectively endorsed that view no matter how anyone may
> wish
> > to parse that.
> >
> > On Mon, Aug 9, 2021 at 6:46 PM Mary Barkworth via Taxacom <
> > taxacom at mailman.nhm.ku.edu> wrote:
> >
> > > A panel to evaluate a complaint is a far cry from "[endorsing] calls
> for
> > > suppression and censorship as being compatible with the Society's
> ethics
> > > policy. It simply means that if someone wants to complain about
> rejection
> > > of their manuscript or whatever, their complaint will be reviewed by a
> > > panel rather than being automatically accepted, dismissed, or referred
> to
> > > the same individual who made the decision that is being appealed.
> > > Mary
> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: Taxacom <taxacom-bounces at mailman.nhm.ku.edu> On Behalf Of John
> > > Grehan via Taxacom
> > > Sent: Monday, August 9, 2021 4:33 PM
> > > To: Peter A Rauch <peterar at berkeley.edu>
> > > Cc: taxacom <taxacom at mailman.nhm.ku.edu>
> > > Subject: [EXT] Re: [Taxacom] NZ Royal Society fails to object to
> > > suppression and censorship of science
> > >
> > > I mentioned earlier that I would provide the R Soc Panel document to
> > > anyone who asks (and will send to Peter next). Point is that the
> Society
> > > set up the panel to 'evaluate' a complaint. The Panel denied any
> conflict
> > > with the Society's ethics and recommended no further action. That is
> the
> > > Society conclusion. Thus the Society, through its Panel, has
> effectively
> > > endorsed calls for suppression and censorship as being compatible with
> > the
> > > Society's ethics policy.
> > >
> > > John Grehan
> > >
> > > On Mon, Aug 9, 2021 at 6:18 PM Peter A Rauch <peterar at berkeley.edu>
> > wrote:
> > >
> > > > John pointed to the published paper by Waters et al., Syst. Biol., as
> > > > the stimulus for his comments, and states [*emphasis* mine]:
> > > >
> > > > "... now the Royal Society Te Apārangi (New Zealand) has trashed its
> > > > slogan "We support New Zealanders to explore, discover and share
> > > > knowledge" *by providing endorsement of suppression and censorship by
> > > > their members through a Panel that concluded that there was nothing
> > > > wrong for their members to do this*.
> > > >
> > > > I'm still missing the point he apparently wants to make (about the
> > > > RSTA's
> > > > Panel) because I don't know (John didn't provide?) what that Panel
> > > > actually wrote ("concluded"), nor what the RSTA wrote (to "endorse"
> > > > the Panel's "conclusions").
> > > >
> > > > Peter R
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > On Sun, Aug 8, 2021 at 3:06 PM John Grehan via Taxacom <
> > > > taxacom at mailman.nhm.ku.edu> wrote:
> > > >
> > > >> Some of you may recall that some years ago several researchers
> > > >> published a paper in Systematic Biology in which they called for the
> > > >> suppression and censorship of a research program they opposed. That
> > > >> they felt it was OK for scientists to openly admit to such practices
> > > >> is shocking enough, but now the Royal Society Te Apārangi (New
> > > >> Zealand) has trashed its slogan "We support New Zealanders to
> > > >> explore, discover and share knowledge" by providing endorsement of
> > > >> suppression and censorship by their members through a Panel that
> > > >> concluded that there was nothing wrong for their members to do this.
> > > >> Perhaps others on Taxacome feel the same way,  that it is OK  for
> > > >> scientists to actively engage in suppression. To me it is
> horrifying,
> > > >> but perhaps I am in an ethical minority. Boggles the mind.
> > > >>
> > > >> John Grehan
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