[Taxacom] unflagged classification change question
Paul van Rijckevorsel
dipteryx at freeler.nl
Tue Jun 12 12:34:58 CDT 2018
Zoologists tend to be divided as to what a "name" is.
The zoological Code is not quite internally consistent.
But Article 5.1 clearly states that "The scientific name
of a species [...] is a combination of [a] generic name
and [a] specific name." Thus, the whole binomen is
a matter of nomenclature.
Also, Recommendation 51G provides for citing the
author responsible for the recombination.
Paul
----- Original Message -----
From: "Francisco Welter-Schultes" <fwelter at gwdg.de>
To: "Paul Kirk" <P.Kirk at kew.org>; "Stephen Thorpe"
<stephen_thorpe at yahoo.co.nz>; <taxacom at mailman.nhm.ku.edu>
Sent: Tuesday, June 12, 2018 5:46 PM
Subject: Re: [Taxacom] unflagged classification change question
> This is the difference between taxonomy and nomenclature. Placing a
> specific name in whichever genus is taxonomy and has no nomenclatural
> relevance in zoology. In botany this is different, as Stephen said. Most
> people don't know that, but this does not change it.
>
> Cheers
> Francisco
>
> Am 12.06.2018 um 15:30 schrieb Paul Kirk:
>> Francisco, are you saying that a change in name is not 'nomenclaturally
>> relevant information'? If so, I would respectfully suggest that most
>> individuals of the species Homo sapiens would disagree with this.
>>
>> Regards,
>>
>> Paul
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Taxacom <taxacom-bounces at mailman.nhm.ku.edu> On Behalf Of Francisco
>> Welter-Schultes
>> Sent: 12 June 2018 14:26
>> To: Stephen Thorpe <stephen_thorpe at yahoo.co.nz>;
>> taxacom at mailman.nhm.ku.edu
>> Subject: Re: [Taxacom] unflagged classification change question
>>
>> It depends. If Smith published a well elaborated taxonomic work with high
>> impact then Option C "ignoring" is a bad option.
>> As Mike said, authors of papers dealing with ecology, conservation or
>> economy are often not up to date with current trends in taxonomy. Helix
>> aspersa is mostly classified in the genus Helix, in hundreds of
>> publications each year, though most taxonomists have since long preferred
>> to place it in the genus Cornu. If I place aspersa in the genus Cornu in
>> a taxonomic work I do not need to justify that, and I can ignore that 100
>> molecular genetical publications of high impact journals in the last two
>> weeks have called this species Helix aspersa. If I select Helix as its
>> current genus in a taxonomic work I should explain and justify my choice.
>>
>> Zoology is not botany. The criteria of publication apply only to
>> nomenclaturally relevant information. Anything that contains only
>> taxonomically relevant information does not need to be published in the
>> sense of the ICZN Code. The unpublished works (internet pages, web
>> interfaces of online databases etc.) however must also follow the rules
>> of forming and citing the zoological names.
>>
>> Cheers
>> Francisco
>>
>> Am 12.06.2018 um 02:34 schrieb Stephen Thorpe:
>>> Francisco said: Option C is also an option
>>>
>>> "An option", certainly, but a bad one! By ignoring and not citing Smith,
>>> it looks like you have overlooked Smith's publication! Some people will
>>> think (erroneously, but nevertheless) that you have overlooked the
>>> "fact" that the "species" has been reinstated from synonymy! As a
>>> general rule, always cite anything that you disagree with!
>>>
>>> The issue in zoology with combinations and synonyms is messy, compared
>>> with botany. I now much prefer the approach in botany. In botany,
>>> combinations and synonymies are formal nomenclatural acts which must be
>>> published according to the botanical code. It still doesn't mean that
>>> such acts have to be followed, but it makes it a lot easier to keep
>>> track of the different published options.
>>>
>>> Stephen
>>>
>>> --------------------------------------------
>>> On Tue, 12/6/18, Francisco Welter-Schultes <fwelter at gwdg.de> wrote:
>>>
>>> Subject: Re: [Taxacom] unflagged classification change question
>>> To: taxacom at mailman.nhm.ku.edu
>>> Received: Tuesday, 12 June, 2018, 12:26 PM
>>> Option C is also an option. Your
>>> reaction should depend on the
>>> particular
>>> significance and impact of Smith's publication.
>>> I find myself in agreement with Mike and
>>> Stephen.
>>> Being classified
>>> as a junior synonym of another name is not an official
>>> status that a name has. Every classification is
>>> always a subjective
>>> judgement. Terms like
>>> "new synonym" or "new combination" may
>>> erroneously
>>> suggest that we are dealing
>>> with an official act. To avoid such
>>> misunderstandings I usually do not recommend
>>> employing such terms at
>>> all. They are not
>>> necessary and have the effect of blurring the
>>> difference between nomenclature and
>>> taxonomy.
>>> If I place Canis lupus in the
>>> genus Homo this will produce a name Homo
>>> lupus. I do not know if somebody did that
>>> before, published, unpublished
>>> in a museum
>>> catalog, or in the internet. Taxonomic treatments do not
>>> need to be published. So actually I would not
>>> be able to say for sure
>>> that my idea was
>>> new.
>>> Francisco
>>> -----
>>> Francisco Welter-Schultes
>>> Am 11.06.2018 um 23:06 schrieb Stephen
>>> Thorpe:
>>> > Hi Derek,
>>> >
>>> I'm deliberately answering your question before reading
>>> the replies by others, so as to give you an independent
>>> response.
>>> > The obvious answer to your
>>> question is simply to explain the situation in the
>>> publication as you explained it in the Taxacom post and just
>>> say that you consider the synonymy to be correct, so, in the
>>> absence of any explanation by Smith for treating it again as
>>> a valid species, you are continuing to treat it as a
>>> synonym. Note that synonymy isn't a formal nomenclatural
>>> act in zoology, so there is no sense in which Smith
>>> "has made it a valid species again". It is simply
>>> a valid species in his opinion, and although everyone is
>>> entitled to their opinion, nobody is obliged to follow.
>>> > I hope this helps (and I apologise in
>>> advance for any repetition of what others may have
>>> replied),
>>> > Cheers,
>>> >
>>> Stephen
>>> >
>>> >
>>> --------------------------------------------
>>> > On Tue, 12/6/18, Derek Sikes <dssikes at alaska.edu>
>>> wrote:
>>> >
>>> >
>>> Subject: [Taxacom] unflagged classification change
>>> question
>>> > To: "taxacom at mailman.nhm.ku.edu"
>>> <Taxacom at mailman.nhm.ku.edu>
>>> > Received: Tuesday, 12 June, 2018, 6:52
>>> AM
>>> >
>>> > All,
>>> >
>>> > For those of
>>> you who keep track of one
>>> > or more
>>> taxonomic classifications on
>>> > which
>>> you are an authority...
>>> >
>>> > I'd like to know how you'd
>>> react to the
>>> > following (all
>>> too-realistic)
>>> > hypothetical
>>> scenario:
>>> >
>>> >
>>> *You find a publication by Smith in
>>> >
>>> which a species name that you feel had
>>> > been justifiably made a junior
>>> synonym
>>> > some years earlier, was
>>> treated as a
>>> > valid species with no
>>> explanation for
>>> > the change. *
>>> >
>>> > In the next
>>> publication you produce on
>>> > the group
>>> do you:
>>> >
>>> > A)
>>> list it as a valid species citing
>>> >
>>> Smith's publication
>>> >
>>> > B) re-synonymize it, cite Smith, and
>>> > explain that there was no evidence
>>> > offered by Smith for the change
>>> >
>>> > C) ignore
>>> (don't cite) Smith and list
>>> > it
>>> as a junior synonym
>>> >
>>> > D) something else? (& for this
>>> > hypothetical, imagine Smith recently
>>> died)
>>> >
>>> >
>>> Thanks,
>>> > Derek
>>> >
>>> > --
>>> >
>>> > +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
>>> > Derek S. Sikes, Curator of Insects
>>> > Associate Professor of Entomology
>>> > University of Alaska Museum
>>> > 1962 Yukon Drive
>>> >
>>> Fairbanks, AK 99775-6960
>>> >
>>> > dssikes at alaska.edu
>>> >
>>> > phone:
>>> 907-474-6278
>>> > FAX: 907-474-5469
>>> >
>>> > University of
>>> Alaska Museum
>>> > - search 400,276
>>> digitized arthropod records
>>> >
>>> https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Farctos.database.museum%2Fuam_ento_all&data=02%7C01%7Cp.kirk%40kew.org%7C8ad3fc36dcc744bae93508d5d0680b93%7C44892b45194046119753a4b3be4ea7fe%7C0%7C0%7C636644067659201568&sdata=C0G92EPsLUzsdr7iMAPA6QaJvyWQZ4XKkiCgJQcH2mY%3D&reserved=0
>>> >
>>> <https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.uaf.edu%2Fmuseum%2Fcollections%2Fento%2F&data=02%7C01%7Cp.kirk%40kew.org%7C8ad3fc36dcc744bae93508d5d0680b93%7C44892b45194046119753a4b3be4ea7fe%7C0%7C0%7C636644067659201568&sdata=m76JWpPUOERpt9DuqEFa31xNiUSZmlAAc0EXknCGADE%3D&reserved=0>
>>> > +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
>>> >
>>> > Interested in
>>> Alaskan Entomology? Join
>>> > the Alaska
>>> Entomological
>>> > Society and / or sign
>>> up for the email
>>> > listserv
>>> "Alaska Entomological
>>> >
>>> Network" at
>>> >
>>> https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.akentsoc.org%2Fcontact_us&data=02%7C01%7Cp.kirk%40kew.org%7C8ad3fc36dcc744bae93508d5d0680b93%7C44892b45194046119753a4b3be4ea7fe%7C0%7C0%7C636644067659201568&sdata=sHwwWY%2BBuSIdrgMnfvAeJV1K8LrF6u4h5w%2FnOlcR5gc%3D&reserved=0
>>>
>>> <https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.akentsoc.org%2Fcontact.php&data=02%7C01%7Cp.kirk%40kew.org%7C8ad3fc36dcc744bae93508d5d0680b93%7C44892b45194046119753a4b3be4ea7fe%7C0%7C0%7C636644067659201568&sdata=ZfWQutlzO2kgne8Y749rO1x87IKPTRozJcU2eCWN8O4%3D&reserved=0>
>>> >
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> > Taxacom Mailing List
>>> > Send Taxacom mailing list
>>> submissions
>>> > to: Taxacom at mailman.nhm.ku.edu
>>> >
>>> >
>>> https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fmailman.nhm.ku.edu%2Fcgi-bin%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Ftaxacom&data=02%7C01%7Cp.kirk%40kew.org%7C8ad3fc36dcc744bae93508d5d0680b93%7C44892b45194046119753a4b3be4ea7fe%7C0%7C0%7C636644067659201568&sdata=LCT6ah4yC7vIC7C57FNugKfJEcflkq2BCMKovreluyo%3D&reserved=0
>>> > The Taxacom Archive back to 1992 may
>>> be
>>> > searched at:
>>> https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Ftaxacom.markmail.org&data=02%7C01%7Cp.kirk%40kew.org%7C8ad3fc36dcc744bae93508d5d0680b93%7C44892b45194046119753a4b3be4ea7fe%7C0%7C0%7C636644067659201568&sdata=UCTOGgSJHqdwPfSG3fsvyNRyjiaL9%2B9SVKlCw7IigLs%3D&reserved=0
>>> > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the
>>> > Web, visit:
>>> https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fmailman.nhm.ku.edu%2Fcgi-bin%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Ftaxacom&data=02%7C01%7Cp.kirk%40kew.org%7C8ad3fc36dcc744bae93508d5d0680b93%7C44892b45194046119753a4b3be4ea7fe%7C0%7C0%7C636644067659201568&sdata=LCT6ah4yC7vIC7C57FNugKfJEcflkq2BCMKovreluyo%3D&reserved=0
>>> > You can reach the person managing
>>> the
>>> > list at: taxacom-owner at mailman.nhm.ku.edu
>>> >
>>> > Nurturing
>>> Nuance while Assaulting
>>> > Ambiguity
>>> for 31 Some Years, 1987-2018.
>>> >
>>> >
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> > Taxacom Mailing List
>>> >
>>> Send Taxacom mailing list submissions to: Taxacom at mailman.nhm.ku.edu
>>> >
>>> >
>>> https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fmailman.nhm.ku.edu%2Fcgi-bin%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Ftaxacom&data=02%7C01%7Cp.kirk%40kew.org%7C8ad3fc36dcc744bae93508d5d0680b93%7C44892b45194046119753a4b3be4ea7fe%7C0%7C0%7C636644067659201568&sdata=LCT6ah4yC7vIC7C57FNugKfJEcflkq2BCMKovreluyo%3D&reserved=0
>>> > The Taxacom Archive back to 1992 may be
>>> searched at:
>>> https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Ftaxacom.markmail.org&data=02%7C01%7Cp.kirk%40kew.org%7C8ad3fc36dcc744bae93508d5d0680b93%7C44892b45194046119753a4b3be4ea7fe%7C0%7C0%7C636644067659201568&sdata=UCTOGgSJHqdwPfSG3fsvyNRyjiaL9%2B9SVKlCw7IigLs%3D&reserved=0
>>> > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the Web,
>>> visit:
>>> https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fmailman.nhm.ku.edu%2Fcgi-bin%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Ftaxacom&data=02%7C01%7Cp.kirk%40kew.org%7C8ad3fc36dcc744bae93508d5d0680b93%7C44892b45194046119753a4b3be4ea7fe%7C0%7C0%7C636644067659201568&sdata=LCT6ah4yC7vIC7C57FNugKfJEcflkq2BCMKovreluyo%3D&reserved=0
>>> > You can reach the person managing the list
>>> at: taxacom-owner at mailman.nhm.ku.edu
>>> >
>>> > Nurturing Nuance
>>> while Assaulting Ambiguity for 31 Some Years, 1987-2018.
>>> >
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Taxacom Mailing List
>>> Send
>>> Taxacom mailing list submissions to: Taxacom at mailman.nhm.ku.edu
>>>
>>> https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fmailman.nhm.ku.edu%2Fcgi-bin%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Ftaxacom&data=02%7C01%7Cp.kirk%40kew.org%7C8ad3fc36dcc744bae93508d5d0680b93%7C44892b45194046119753a4b3be4ea7fe%7C0%7C0%7C636644067659201568&sdata=LCT6ah4yC7vIC7C57FNugKfJEcflkq2BCMKovreluyo%3D&reserved=0
>>> The Taxacom Archive back to 1992 may be
>>> searched at:
>>> https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Ftaxacom.markmail.org&data=02%7C01%7Cp.kirk%40kew.org%7C8ad3fc36dcc744bae93508d5d0680b93%7C44892b45194046119753a4b3be4ea7fe%7C0%7C0%7C636644067659201568&sdata=UCTOGgSJHqdwPfSG3fsvyNRyjiaL9%2B9SVKlCw7IigLs%3D&reserved=0
>>> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the Web, visit:
>>>
>>> https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fmailman.nhm.ku.edu%2Fcgi-bin%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Ftaxacom&data=02%7C01%7Cp.kirk%40kew.org%7C8ad3fc36dcc744bae93508d5d0680b93%7C44892b45194046119753a4b3be4ea7fe%7C0%7C0%7C636644067659211576&sdata=sbiQPWBa5gZB13v%2Bg3a0nALIjYCyaWyli4d9rH3W4sM%3D&reserved=0
>>> You can reach the person managing the list at:
>>> taxacom-owner at mailman.nhm.ku.edu
>>> Nurturing Nuance while
>>> Assaulting Ambiguity for 31 Some Years, 1987-2018.
>>> .
>>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Taxacom Mailing List
>> Send Taxacom mailing list submissions to: Taxacom at mailman.nhm.ku.edu
>>
>> https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fmailman.nhm.ku.edu%2Fcgi-bin%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Ftaxacom&data=02%7C01%7Cp.kirk%40kew.org%7C8ad3fc36dcc744bae93508d5d0680b93%7C44892b45194046119753a4b3be4ea7fe%7C0%7C0%7C636644067659211576&sdata=sbiQPWBa5gZB13v%2Bg3a0nALIjYCyaWyli4d9rH3W4sM%3D&reserved=0
>> The Taxacom Archive back to 1992 may be searched at:
>> https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Ftaxacom.markmail.org&data=02%7C01%7Cp.kirk%40kew.org%7C8ad3fc36dcc744bae93508d5d0680b93%7C44892b45194046119753a4b3be4ea7fe%7C0%7C0%7C636644067659211576&sdata=jX6WsW5%2BuCRPWul0bMSxdHaC4UsdR%2FPZqDG%2FVmAvcfg%3D&reserved=0
>> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the Web, visit:
>> https://emea01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fmailman.nhm.ku.edu%2Fcgi-bin%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Ftaxacom&data=02%7C01%7Cp.kirk%40kew.org%7C8ad3fc36dcc744bae93508d5d0680b93%7C44892b45194046119753a4b3be4ea7fe%7C0%7C0%7C636644067659211576&sdata=sbiQPWBa5gZB13v%2Bg3a0nALIjYCyaWyli4d9rH3W4sM%3D&reserved=0
>> You can reach the person managing the list at:
>> taxacom-owner at mailman.nhm.ku.edu
>>
>> Nurturing Nuance while Assaulting Ambiguity for 31 Some Years, 1987-2018.
>>
> _______________________________________________
> Taxacom Mailing List
> Send Taxacom mailing list submissions to: Taxacom at mailman.nhm.ku.edu
>
> http://mailman.nhm.ku.edu/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/taxacom
> The Taxacom Archive back to 1992 may be searched at:
> http://taxacom.markmail.org
> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the Web, visit:
> http://mailman.nhm.ku.edu/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/taxacom
> You can reach the person managing the list at:
> taxacom-owner at mailman.nhm.ku.edu
>
> Nurturing Nuance while Assaulting Ambiguity for 31 Some Years, 1987-2018.
>
More information about the Taxacom
mailing list