[Taxacom] Paywall our taxonomic tidbit

Elena Kupriyanova Elena.Kupriyanova at austmus.gov.au
Thu Jan 14 18:07:49 CST 2016 

Dear colleagues,

I am really confused by now re what the point of this discussion is. Should we make our taxonomic papers open access or should we use our grant money to do so instead of paying for it out our own pockets? I honestly cannot see any paywall - whenever I need a paper, I just write to the author and ask for a pdf. I am happy to send my own papers to anybody who cares to read them (gosh, where is a chance they might even cite me ;) Besides, there is Researchgate...
Best,
Lena

Dr. Elena Kupriyanova
Senior Research Scientist
Marine Invertebrates

Associate Editor, 
Records of the Australian Museum

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-----Original Message-----
From: Taxacom [mailto:taxacom-bounces at mailman.nhm.ku.edu] On Behalf Of Daniel Leo Gustafsson
Sent: Friday, 15 January 2016 10:28 AM
Cc: taxacom at mailman.nhm.ku.edu
Subject: Re: [Taxacom] Paywall our taxonomic tidbit

How is the fact that you have to pay per page published an incentive to write as many pages as possible, compared to not having to pay per page?

Cheers,
Daniel

On Thu, Jan 14, 2016 at 4:24 PM, Stephen Thorpe <stephen_thorpe at yahoo.co.nz>
wrote:

> Cut the ad hominem rhetoric Frank. I don't see evil everywhere. But I 
> can do the maths and see that $20/page multiplied by many 
> thousands/year of taxonomic papers of limited interest amounts to a 
> significant amount of public money spent on making stuff available to 
> read when hardly anyone wants to read it. It is also an incentive for 
> some authors to pad out their papers to be as long winded as possible.
>
> Stephen
>
> --------------------------------------------
> On Fri, 15/1/16, Frank T. Krell <Frank.Krell at dmns.org> wrote:
>
>  Subject: RE: [Taxacom] Paywall our taxonomic tidbit
>  To: "Stephen Thorpe" <stephen_thorpe at yahoo.co.nz>, "
> taxacom at mailman.nhm.ku.edu" <taxacom at mailman.nhm.ku.edu>, "Peter Uetz" 
> < peter at uetz.us>
>  Received: Friday, 15 January, 2016, 11:51 AM
>
>  Disseminating results is
>  an essential part of the scientific endeavor. If public  money is 
> intended for research, this includes making the  results known.
>
>  You see evil
>  problems everywhere, don't you, Stephen. Even in a  $20/page open 
> access charge.
>
>  Frank
>
>
>  Dr Frank T. Krell
>  Curator of
>  Entomology
>  Commissioner, International
>  Commission on Zoological Nomenclature  Chair,  ICZN ZooBank Committee  
> Department of Zoology
>
>  Denver Museum of Nature & Science
>  2001 Colorado Boulevard
>  Denver, CO 80205-5798 USA
>  Frank.Krell at dmns.org
>
>  Phone: (+1) (303) 370-8244
>  Fax: (+1) (303) 331-6492
>  
> http://scanmail.trustwave.com/?c=4062&d=9q6Y1gpNzmYJLs1blKtVUODBKTPTcx
> 6eV69BDl9DkA&s=978&u=http%3a%2f%2fwww%2edmns%2eorg%2fscience%2fmuseum-
> scientists%2ffrank-krell  lab page: 
> http://scanmail.trustwave.com/?c=4062&d=9q6Y1gpNzmYJLs1blKtVUODBKTPTcx
> 6eV6ARClkQxw&s=978&u=http%3a%2f%2fwww%2edmns%2eorg%2fkrell-lab
>
>  -----Original Message-----
>  From: Taxacom [mailto:taxacom-bounces at mailman.nhm.ku.edu]
>  On Behalf Of Stephen Thorpe
>  Sent: Thursday,
>  January 14, 2016 3:02 PM
>  To: taxacom at mailman.nhm.ku.edu;
>  Peter Uetz <peter at uetz.us>
>  Subject: Re: [Taxacom] Paywall our taxonomic  tidbit
>
>  Peter Uetz said:
>  Just make your papers available to everybody, not just the  few lucky 
> ones
>
>  Not sure if
>  he was being sarcastic? I hope so. It amounts to "just  make your 
> papers available to everybody (whether they want  to read it or not), 
> not just the few who actually want to  read it (and pay for it with 
> public money intended for  research!)"
>
>  Stephen
>
>
>  --------------------------------------------
>  On Fri, 15/1/16, Peter Uetz <peter at uetz.us>
>  wrote:
>
>   Subject: Re:
>  [Taxacom] Paywall our taxonomic tidbit
>   To:
>  taxacom at mailman.nhm.ku.edu
>   Received: Friday, 15 January, 2016, 7:20 AM
>
>
>   Yes! —
>  Zootaxa is probably the best deal you can get.
>   I paid for an open access paper in Zootaxa out  of my own  pocket, 
> and this was a single author paper.
>
>   For teams, some of which may
>  have grant money available, it  is a no brainer.
>   Just make your papers available to everybody,  not just the  few 
> lucky ones.
>   Especially
>  if you believe that nothing in biology makes  sense except  in the 
> light of taxonomy, sorry..., evolution
>   :)
>
>
>   > ------------------------------
>   >
>   > Message: 9
>   > Date: Thu, 14 Jan 2016 13:58:22 +1300  > From: "Geoff Read" 
> <gread at actrix.gen.nz>  > To: taxacom at mailman.nhm.ku.edu  > Subject: 
> [Taxacom] Paywall our taxonomic tidbit  >
>  Message-ID:
>   >     <88e32d0d97f3055d3f25280814fd767f.squirrel at my.actrix.co.nz>
>   > Content-Type:
>  text/plain;charset=iso-8859-1  >  > Am I  unreasonable in expecting 
> minor contributions to  Zootaxa  to be  > affordable for authors as 
> open access as a  convenience  for their readers?
>   > For
>  instance that's USD 20 for each author in today's  worst 2 page case!
>   > Hopefully they earn
>  (or did) much more that per hour.
>   >
>   > http://scanmail.trustwave.com/?c=4062&d=9q6Y1gpNzmYJLs1blKtVUODBKTPTcx6eV6JGXFkVzg&s=978&u=http%3a%2f%2fwww%2emapress%2ecom%2fj%2fzt%2farticle%2fview%2fzootaxa%2e4066%2e2%2e5
>   >
>   > Happens quite
>  frequently - what are these contributors  thinking? Should  we  > 
> perhaps start a fund to help them out?
>   >
>   > --
>
>  > Geoffrey B. Read, Ph.D.
>   >
>  Wellington, NEW ZEALAND
>   > gread at actrix.gen.nz
>   >
>   >
>
>
>
>  ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>   Peter Uetz, PhD
>   Associate
>  Professor
>   Center for the Study of
>  Biological Complexity  Virginia Commonwealth University
>   1015 Floyd Ave
>   PO Box
>  842030
>   Richmond, VA 23284
>
>
>   Ph: 804-827-4573
>
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