[Taxacom] Important follow-up regarding Nabu Press, etc.

[Michael A. Ivie]

Stephen

My point has nothing to do with your response.  Why are you attacking
Doug' motives personally over this?  What does his stock ownership have to
do with such a thread?  You are not debating his information, but his
motives.  We don't do that with you, no matter how silly the nattering
gets.

WHY are you berating Doug?

Mike

> so, Mike, you are suggesting that I am a hypocrite, and should therefore
> stop trying to contribute to the thread that Doug started by examining the
> issue objectively from all angles? Well, I would say that if one posts to
> a list server, one cannot demand that the only replies are by those who
> are in agreement with one's views! Somewhat analogous to publishing
> something, and then expecting to retain full control over it. As for
> hypocrisy, well maybe I am one, and maybe it is a bad thing to be, but
> consider this: who is better (i.e., more ethical)? (A) a murderer who lets
> other murderers get away with it; or (B) a murderer who reports other
> murderers to the police? Both are pretty unethical, of course, but which
> is better, eh? Cheers, Stephen
>  
>
> ________________________________
> From: Michael A. Ivie <mivie at montana.edu>
> To: Stephen Thorpe <stephen_thorpe at yahoo.co.nz>
> Cc: Doug Yanega <dyanega at ucr.edu>; "TAXACOM at MAILMAN.NHM.KU.EDU"
> <taxacom at mailman.nhm.ku.edu>
> Sent: Friday, 30 March 2012 1:43 PM
> Subject: Re: [Taxacom] Important follow-up regarding Nabu Press, etc.
>
> Stephen,
>
> Given the unending amounts of time you spend on blathering about seemingly
> pointless nit-picky issues that do not directly benefit you, simply
> because you have some sense of it being important because it is right, WHY
> are you browbeating Doug about this?  Even if you are right, which you may
> not be, that it is pointless if there is no personal benefit, who are you,
> of all people, to belittle that activity?
>
> Mike
>> ... and you are doing all this on behalf of BHL, are you Doug? Do you
>> own
>> shares in BHL?? :)
>>
>>
>>
>> ________________________________
>> From: Doug Yanega <dyanega at ucr.edu>
>> To: TAXACOM at MAILMAN.NHM.KU.EDU
>> Cc: ECN-L at listserv.unl.edu; entomo-l at listserv.uoguelph.ca
>> Sent: Friday, 30 March 2012 1:25 PM
>> Subject: [Taxacom] Important follow-up regarding Nabu Press, etc.
>>
>> A few tidbits from various places have been coming in, and an
>> interesting pattern has emerged.
>>
>> After checking on a variety of insect taxa on Amazon for Nabu Press
>> items, I had originally done a quick search in other areas of
>> zoology, and only noted the volume of Nabu offerings, for all of the
>> non-insect keywords I tried (e.g., 209 results for "Nabu Press
>> ornithology"). After having received some messages regarding negative
>> findings of recent works being pirated, and other messages about
>> metadata problems, I started looking closer, and must admit that I
>> have yet to find any non-entomological works by Nabu that are not
>> pre-1923, and no one has written to me reporting such cases (exactly
>> the contrary - I've gotten a few messages saying there is nothing of
>> recent vintage among the many Nabu offerings on topic X). I'm now
>> suspicious that this may be a more limited offense than I had
>> previously thought - limited to entomological publications, at least
>> in terms of recent, copyrighted works being advertised and sold as
>> pre-1923 works. PLEASE, if anyone is aware of non-entomological works
>> of this sort, let me know. This could be very important in tracking
>> down how and why these works came to be on Nabu's publishing list.
>>
>> In essence, there is circumstantial evidence that it may have been as
>> restricted a cause as a single large "contaminated" source of bad
>> metadata - hundreds or thousands of documents, thematically unified,
>> and all incorrectly tagged as being copyright-free. There are
>> definitely single sources like this which have supplied large digital
>> entomology archives to IA and/or BHL, and leads are being pursued
>> even now. Several documents appearing in the Internet Archive,
>> including the one for which I was co-author, do indeed show up with
>> no indication of copyright, or a mistaken listing stating
>> "NOT_IN_COPYRIGHT" (the entry for my paper). This could explain a LOT.
>>
>> Accordingly, it looks like my initial broad warning about the scale
>> may have been a mistake, based on the apparently unique source of the
>> mislabeled files in circulation: some entomology literature
>> digitization effort. It's still bad, but it may affect a lot fewer
>> genuinely copyrighted documents than I'd supposed. So, I'm not quite
>> as bad as Chicken Little, but it looks like I should apologize for
>> casting such a broad net, if it turns out that only entomological
>> works are affected.
>>
>> Sincerely,
>> --
>>
>> Doug Yanega        Dept. of Entomology        Entomology Research Museum
>> Univ. of California, Riverside, CA 92521-0314        skype: dyanega
>> phone: (951) 827-4315 (standard disclaimer: opinions are mine, not
>> UCR's)
>>               http://cache.ucr.edu/~heraty/yanega.html
>>   "There are some enterprises in which a careful disorderliness
>>         is the true method" - Herman Melville, Moby Dick, Chap. 82
>>
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>
>
> --
> Michael A. Ivie, Ph.D., F.R.E.S.
> Montana Entomology Collection
> Marsh Labs, Room 50
> 1901 S. 19th Ave
> Montana State University
> Bozeman, MT 59717-3020
> USA
>
> (406) 994-4610 (voice)
> (406) 994-6029 (FAX)
> mivie at montana.edu


-- 
Michael A. Ivie, Ph.D., F.R.E.S.
Montana Entomology Collection
Marsh Labs, Room 50
1901 S. 19th Ave
Montana State University
Bozeman, MT 59717-3020
USA

(406) 994-4610 (voice)
(406) 994-6029 (FAX)
mivie at montana.edu