[Taxacom] Open Access taxonomy

Wed May 25 12:49:21 CDT 2011

Yes. Living in Iran and trying to train the next generation of students
makes it very clear that we need access well beyond the traditional (elite)
university and museum. And it makes one more clear, that is we need not just
access to the publication per se, but all the underlying material. What does
a description help, if you do not have a reference collection? Links to
images and DNA sequences etc makes a huge head start. This from the point of
view of the "field".

Rod and others touched an important element: science is not commercial
publishing. We have a different business model. Unfortunately, neither most
of us, nor the big industry and law makers are so far aware of that. We pay
to create content through a huge investment from our governments, fewer
through our own pockets. A novelist on the other hand needs the revenue to
pay for the effort he made by writing the novel, the play. And generally the
latter pays of, but it does not for us. So, we need to make an effort to
educate our law makers that we  need change the law. And this is happening
slowly. So, open access not equal no business model. Just one the other way
round.

Donat

-----Original Message-----
From: taxacom-bounces at mailman.nhm.ku.edu
[mailto:taxacom-bounces at mailman.nhm.ku.edu] On Behalf Of Roderic Page
Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2011 10:10 PM
To: Taxacom
Cc: John Noyes; Frank.Krell at dmns.org>
Subject: Re: [Taxacom] Open Access taxonomy

Dear Frank,

On 25 May 2011, at 17:56, <Frank.Krell at dmns.org> <Frank.Krell at dmns.org>
wrote:

> Well, isn't that the reason why we have a library system? Not each new
reader has to pay to read. Yes, you need a library pass, and access to a
library which has access to the literature you need. However, even when I
was a school kid, I managed to get almost all the literature I needed
(scientific papers, I mean), with very little investment (train tickets to
the next library, interlibrary loan fees).

Take a look around, libraries are in trouble (e.g.,
http://www.the-scientist.com/blog/display/57491/ ).

> 
> Yes, it is much more efficient to stay glued in front of a computer screen
and have everything readily on hand. 

Or access the information on a smart phone in the middle of the countryside,
or on an airplane, or in a coffee shop. The notion that online means on a
desktop might apply a few years ago, but no longer. 

I absolutely want everything on hand right now. And I suggest the next
cohort of people who are foolish enough to join this field will expect
nothing less.

> 
> And from the publisher's standpoint: The subscription model still works.
For example, if I want to eat a pizza, I pay for it and get it. Oh well,
this is just the 99.999% of the world outside scientific publishing...

There are all sorts of business models that we could consider, and I'd
suggest there's a lot of variation in the "the 99.999% of the world outside
scientific publishing". Just take a look at what has happened to the music
industry since the advent of Napster, iTunes, and Spotify.

Regards

Rod

> 
> Frank
> 
> 
> Dr Frank T. Krell 
> Curator of Entomology 
> Commissioner, International Commission on Zoological Nomenclature
> Chair, ICZN ZooBank Committee
> Department of Zoology 
> Denver Museum of Nature & Science 
> 2001 Colorado Boulevard 
> Denver, CO 80205-5798 USA 
> Frank.Krell at dmns.org 
> Phone: (+1) (303) 370-8244 
> Fax: (+1) (303) 331-6492 
> http://www.dmns.org/science/museum-scientists/frank-krell
> lab page: http://www.dmns.org/krell-lab
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: taxacom-bounces at mailman.nhm.ku.edu
[mailto:taxacom-bounces at mailman.nhm.ku.edu] On Behalf Of Roderic Page
> Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2011 10:39 AM
> To: Taxacom
> Cc: John Noyes
> Subject: Re: [Taxacom] Open Access taxonomy
> 
> Dear John,
> 
> Sure, there's no such thing as a free lunch. But there's an asymmetry
between a one-time cost to publish, versus requiring each  new reader having
to pay to read. And that's even without considering the potential for reuse
that comes with (most) Open Access articles.
> 
> Regards
> 
> Rod
> 
> On 25 May 2011, at 17:17, John Noyes wrote:
> 
>> Well, I suppose it lies behind an "input" paywall (pay to publish) or
>> output paywall (pay to access) or both. You take your pick. Very few
>> "open access" publications are open and free on either or both sides of
>> the publishing spectrum. That includes Zookeys, Zootaxa, and Plos One.
>> Someone has to pay somewhere.
>> 
>> John
>> 
>> John Noyes
>> Scientific Associate
>> Department of Entomology
>> Natural History Museum
>> Cromwell Road
>> South Kensington
>> London SW7 5BD 
>> UK
>> jsn at nhm.ac.uk
>> Tel.: +44 (0) 207 942 5594
>> Fax.: +44 (0) 207 942 5229
>> 
>> Universal Chalcidoidea Database (everything you wanted to know about
>> chalcidoids and more):
>> www.nhm.ac.uk/chalcidoids 
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: taxacom-bounces at mailman.nhm.ku.edu
>> [mailto:taxacom-bounces at mailman.nhm.ku.edu] On Behalf Of Roderic Page
>> Sent: 25 May 2011 16:27
>> To: Taxacom
>> Subject: [Taxacom] Open Access taxonomy
>> 
>> Dear All,
>> 
>> At the risk of channelling Donat Agosti, I find it somewhat depressing
>> that only two of the International Institute for Species Exploration's
>> Top 10 new species for 2010 (http://species.asu.edu/Top10 ) were
>> published as Open Access articles (see
>> http://iphylo.blogspot.com/2011/05/top-ten-new-species-described-in-2010
>> .html or http://tinyurl.com/3j69cw5 ).
>> 
>> Choice of where to publish is obviously influenced by several, sometimes
>> conflicting criteria, but it's a pity that so much of taxonomy's output
>> lies behind paywalls.
>> 
>> Regards
>> 
>> Rod
>> 
>> ---------------------------------------------------------
>> Roderic Page
>> Professor of Taxonomy
>> Institute of Biodiversity, Animal Health and Comparative Medicine
>> College of Medical, Veterinary and Life Sciences
>> Graham Kerr Building
>> University of Glasgow
>> Glasgow G12 8QQ, UK
>> 
>> Email: r.page at bio.gla.ac.uk
>> Tel: +44 141 330 4778
>> Fax: +44 141 330 2792
>> AIM: rodpage1962 at aim.com
>> Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1112517192
>> Twitter: http://twitter.com/rdmpage
>> Blog: http://iphylo.blogspot.com
>> Home page: http://taxonomy.zoology.gla.ac.uk/rod/rod.html
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> 
>> Taxacom Mailing List
>> Taxacom at mailman.nhm.ku.edu
>> http://mailman.nhm.ku.edu/mailman/listinfo/taxacom
>> 
>> The Taxacom archive going back to 1992 may be searched with either of
>> these methods:
>> 
>> (1) by visiting http://taxacom.markmail.org
>> 
>> (2) a Google search specified as:
>> site:mailman.nhm.ku.edu/pipermail/taxacom  your search terms here
>> 
> 
> ---------------------------------------------------------
> Roderic Page
> Professor of Taxonomy
> Institute of Biodiversity, Animal Health and Comparative Medicine
> College of Medical, Veterinary and Life Sciences
> Graham Kerr Building
> University of Glasgow
> Glasgow G12 8QQ, UK
> 
> Email: r.page at bio.gla.ac.uk
> Tel: +44 141 330 4778
> Fax: +44 141 330 2792
> AIM: rodpage1962 at aim.com
> Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1112517192
> Twitter: http://twitter.com/rdmpage
> Blog: http://iphylo.blogspot.com
> Home page: http://taxonomy.zoology.gla.ac.uk/rod/rod.html
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> 
> Taxacom Mailing List
> Taxacom at mailman.nhm.ku.edu
> http://mailman.nhm.ku.edu/mailman/listinfo/taxacom
> 
> The Taxacom archive going back to 1992 may be searched with either of
these methods:
> 
> (1) by visiting http://taxacom.markmail.org
> 
> (2) a Google search specified as:
site:mailman.nhm.ku.edu/pipermail/taxacom  your search terms here
> 

---------------------------------------------------------
Roderic Page
Professor of Taxonomy
Institute of Biodiversity, Animal Health and Comparative Medicine
College of Medical, Veterinary and Life Sciences
Graham Kerr Building
University of Glasgow
Glasgow G12 8QQ, UK

Email: r.page at bio.gla.ac.uk
Tel: +44 141 330 4778
Fax: +44 141 330 2792
AIM: rodpage1962 at aim.com
Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1112517192
Twitter: http://twitter.com/rdmpage
Blog: http://iphylo.blogspot.com
Home page: http://taxonomy.zoology.gla.ac.uk/rod/rod.html

_______________________________________________

Taxacom Mailing List
Taxacom at mailman.nhm.ku.edu
http://mailman.nhm.ku.edu/mailman/listinfo/taxacom

The Taxacom archive going back to 1992 may be searched with either of these
methods:

(1) by visiting http://taxacom.markmail.org

(2) a Google search specified as:  site:mailman.nhm.ku.edu/pipermail/taxacom
your search terms here

__________ Information from ESET Smart Security, version of virus signature
database 6151 (20110525) __________

The message was checked by ESET Smart Security.

http://www.eset.com

__________ Information from ESET Smart Security, version of virus signature
database 6151 (20110525) __________

The message was checked by ESET Smart Security.

http://www.eset.com