[Taxacom] New lizard species

[Robin Leech]

This thread just aint gonna die, will it?
I think the disease is lastworditis.
Robin
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Steve Manning" <sdmanning at asub.edu>
To: "Stephen Thorpe" <stephen_thorpe at yahoo.co.nz>; "Richard Pyle" 
<deepreef at bishopmuseum.org>; <taxacom at mailman.nhm.ku.edu>
Sent: Friday, June 11, 2010 5:41 PM
Subject: Re: [Taxacom] New lizard species


> Aha!  If a character is an attribute of "organisms" (plural) what
> this must mean is that one organism isn't enough!  For all animals
> known only from a single "type specimen" rather than "specimens" you
> had better find another one quickly and designate it as the "co-type"
> or the species will be deposed ("synonymized")
> forthwith!  Populations may be closer to correct!
>
> By edict,
> Another Steve,
> Commissioner of --- (you name it)
>
> At 08:31 PM 6/8/2010, Stephen Thorpe wrote:
>>I agree that is the issue (at least the "small picture" issue)
>>
>>Yet again:
>>
>>ICZN glossary:
>>character, n.
>>Any attribute of organisms used for recognizing, differentiating, or
>>classifying taxa
>>
>>to understand my point, it might help to read (or at least glance at):
>>
>>http://www.jstor.org/stable/2671956
>>http://www.springerlink.com/content/p306x3k440278g55/
>>etc.
>>
>>when you say
>>  >attribute of organisms (Code Glossary)<
>>you evidently mean intrinsic attribute of organisms, whereas the
>>posted diagnosis makes use of extrinsic attributes of organisms
>>(i.e., attributes of their populations)
>>
>>however the Code reads "ANY attribute of organisms ...', which I
>>interpret as unrestricted intrinsic or extrinsic
>>
>>what the Code says and what it intended to say may be two different
>>things, but if so, then it is the fault of the Code, not the authors
>>of taxa, if they follow what it actually said rather than what was 
>>intended ...
>>
>>Stephen
>>
>>
>>
>>________________________________
>>From: Richard Pyle <deepreef at bishopmuseum.org>
>>To: Stephen Thorpe <stephen_thorpe at yahoo.co.nz>; 
>>taxacom at mailman.nhm.ku.edu
>>Sent: Wed, 9 June, 2010 1:12:40 PM
>>Subject: RE: [Taxacom] New lizard species
>>
>>
>>Testing out my repaired email connection -- so if this doesn't go, so much
>>the better....
>>
>> > By my count, four active ICZN Commissioners, and one former ICZN
>>Commissioner
>> > (including two former presidents of ICZN) have all weighed in on this
>>thread.
>> > They have been unanimous in their assesment that the diagnosis, at 
>> > least
>>as
>> > presented to Taxacom, fails to comply with Article 13.1.1 of the ICZN 
>> > Code
>> >
>> > truth by consensus, eh?
>>
>>Truth?  Goodness no! But a reasonably good indication of an appropriate
>>interpretation of the Code.
>>
>> > the ICZN has no mandate whatsoever to place any restrictions on what
>> > is or is not an allowable taxonomic character or taxonomic methodology,
>> > it can only regulate NAMES for taxa, by prescribing FORMATS (not 
>> > CONTENT)
>> > that taxonomists must follow
>> >
>> > if you don't understand that, then you should not, IMHO, be a 
>> > commissioner
>>...
>>
>>Hmmmm....not sure where that one came from.  The Commissioners of which I
>>spoke were specifically talking about the availability of the name under
>>Art. 13.1.1.  The issue is not whether something is, or is not an 
>>allowable
>>taxonomic character.  The issue is about whether the character is an
>>attribute of organisms (Code Glossary), or an attribute of populations
>>(posted Diagnosis).
>>
>>Aloha,
>>Rich
>>
>>
>>
>>_______________________________________________
>>
>>Taxacom Mailing List
>>Taxacom at mailman.nhm.ku.edu
>>http://mailman.nhm.ku.edu/mailman/listinfo/taxacom
>>
>>The Taxacom archive going back to 1992 may be searched with either
>>of these methods:
>>
>>(1) http://taxacom.markmail.org
>>
>>Or (2) a Google search specified
>>as:  site:mailman.nhm.ku.edu/pipermail/taxacom  your search terms here
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
>
> Taxacom Mailing List
> Taxacom at mailman.nhm.ku.edu
> http://mailman.nhm.ku.edu/mailman/listinfo/taxacom
>
> The Taxacom archive going back to 1992 may be searched with either of 
> these methods:
>
> (1) http://taxacom.markmail.org
>
> Or (2) a Google search specified as: 
> site:mailman.nhm.ku.edu/pipermail/taxacom  your search terms here
>